VO2 Max and Longevity: How to Measure and Improve Your Cardiorespiratory Fitness

00:00:00: What on earth is VO two max?

00:00:01: So Max, what is it?

00:00:03: every time you increase your view to max by three and a half units.

00:00:06: You lower your mortality rate by thirteen percent.

00:00:09: the highest officially measured were seventy eight for Joan Benoit and ninety seven four Oscar Swenson or ninety six for Björn Daley.

00:00:17: that's so impressive

00:00:18: man!

00:00:18: You even find triathletes in their eighties who still have a vo two max of forty or fifty.

00:00:23: That is already very, very strong.

00:00:25: Whenever it's about health you want to strive for excellence.

00:00:28: that's actually the most important thing.

00:00:30: Yeah!

00:00:30: It's more predictive of your life expectancy than diabetes or smoking.

00:00:38: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Beyond Lifespan.

00:00:41: Hi Max!

00:00:42: In our

00:00:44: last two episodes we talked about our routine And there was one point where weren't really happy with when it came to tracking... ...and that was VO-II MAX.

00:00:54: So we thought, we'd read up on what can do to improve our VO-II Max.

00:00:58: And why not just an episode of this really cool metric right away?

00:01:07: Yeah exactly!

00:01:07: So the VO-I Max is a bit painful subject I think so... We talked about it last Episode too and both pretty lean guys.

00:01:15: Our focus naturally more on strength training to build mass.

00:01:18: you know with guys after all I remember really well after school.

00:01:23: Uh, I went running quite often back then.

00:01:26: um i generally did a lot of endurance sports as a kid and Then at some point during university?

00:01:32: I said yeah No somehow now i'm only doing strength training And i'll just stop doing that.

00:01:36: i'll only lose weight anyway than i'll have to eat even more.

00:01:39: Um it's also financial issue

00:01:42: During University

00:01:43: exactly during university and uh Now over the years i have to be honest i'm not that happy with it anymore.

00:01:49: So i'm currently at a vo two max of forty eight.

00:01:52: That is, I'd say above average they say but it's still not good.

00:01:56: It's not excellent either and we know from many well-known fellow influences that VO two max Is one of the most relevant markers to calculate your probability Of dying also to calculate Your age biological age And Basically also tells you okay how much longer can You live what?

00:02:14: Can you actually Still do with your body?

00:02:16: plus How long will stay independent right exactly

00:02:19: Plus how Long you'll Stay Independent.

00:02:20: so That is definitely something you have to look at.

00:02:24: And that's why I set a goal for myself, and you did too of course... Yeah we absolutely got the VO-II Max to excellent!

00:02:33: ...and then keep it at excellent forever compared our age

00:02:36: group.".

00:02:49: And for anyone who has never heard of percentiles, if you have a percentile in your case it's seventy-four.

00:02:56: That means that you are better or just as good at seventy four per cent of the population and the sample was looked so higher than before.

00:03:08: For example at the ninetyth percentile you're better then ninety percent of the populations.

00:03:13: So to put this into perspective we'll include calculator.

00:03:18: The starting point is different.

00:03:19: As a kid, I did a lot of endurance sports in the sense that we just went hiking in the mountains a lot with my parents.

00:03:26: And i'm very grateful to them for that because now I have a very good endurance base and I noticed that even if I haven't done any sports for months or at least nothing in the direction of endurance... ...I get back in shape very quickly!

00:03:39: I go running two or three times and then I'm back to a very Good level very quickly.

00:03:44: so thanks mom Thanks dad And right now I have a VO two max of fifty-two.

00:03:50: For my age and gender, that's the eighty seventh percentile.

00:03:53: so actually not that bad but whenever it is about health you want to strive for excellence.

00:03:59: That' s actually most important thing.

00:04:01: You have best possible prerequisite The best possible basis in future and thats why we both set our goals for ourselves around sixty.

00:04:10: So if you want a VO Two Max or we want a vo two max over sixty by comparison, the ninety seven point five percentile.

00:04:18: So you're already better than ninety-seven point five per cent of the rest of the population and then going up?

00:04:25: Of course The VO two max steps get bigger in the percentile steps gets a bit smaller because it naturally squeezes together a bit more there.

00:04:32: but that is very exciting.

00:04:34: And why do even want to have such high goal?

00:04:36: You already said its important for independence.

00:04:39: It's important.

00:04:39: be able to assess your performance capacity In first place greatly increases the probability of staying healthy in general.

00:04:47: And I found that really interesting too because if anyone has read Outlive, That's The Book by Peter Atia.

00:04:52: He is an American doctor very well known makes good content to also have a podcast called The Drive and his book he wrote about Centenarian Decathlon which was like a decathlon for hundred year olds and VO-II Max plays role on it as well.

00:05:06: The underlying question what do i achieve today?

00:05:10: To be able this or that activity?

00:05:14: And if it's about maybe going for a walk with the grandkids or, maybe running a bit faster.

00:05:20: Or just walking fast.

00:05:22: then you have to have a certain prerequisite today because its completely clear that all of metrics will get worse right?

00:05:30: You can't stop there but you can slow down.

00:05:33: and thats what is about.

00:05:34: That means If still want go jogging at one hundred probably need VO two max around thirty to even be able to do jogging.

00:05:42: Then calculate what VO two max I need to have today so that with the normal decline, i'll still manage that thirty.

00:05:50: And we will talk about this decline later too how you can slow it down and how much of a difference actually makes.

00:05:57: but first We should probably go into what VO Two Max Actually is because were deep in the topic.

00:06:03: maybe some who are listening To us Today Are Too.

00:06:06: But Some Will also be thinking What on Earth Is VO two Max?

00:06:09: So Max?

00:06:12: My Pleasure Yeah.

00:06:13: So in the end, it's simply how much oxygen your body can take in at its maximum and that depends on a lot of different factors.

00:06:20: In The End You Can Probably Imagine Okay An Athlete Will Likely Be Able To Take In More Oxygen Than An Average Person Let'S Say And That'S Simply Because The Athlete Has A Lot Of Better Physical Conditions Above All It'S Because Their Muscles Have Significantly More Mitochondria.

00:06:37: That Means They Can Process Significently More Oxigen.

00:06:40: That'S Why They Can Also Use Significately More Oxige And that's why the body is trained to take in more oxygen as well.

00:06:48: That's basically where The Difference lies, it's super simple.

00:06:50: It really just measures maximum oxygen uptake

00:06:54: Exactly!

00:06:56: During very intense physical activity.

00:06:59: Originally VO-II max was always measured.

00:07:01: We'll get into this in a moment with classic spiroagometry.

00:07:06: If you've ever been an internist and had stress test You sit on bike or stand at treadmill wearing a mask on your face, where it can be measured very precisely.

00:07:17: But that also involves a certain amount of exertion because you want to measure the maximum and not what the oxygen uptake is right now while sitting but you wanna test the maximum And until now we'll get to that in a moment.

00:07:31: That was only possible with spiroagometry... ...but there are other ways too.

00:07:36: Which What all plays into that?

00:07:43: Yeah, basically you just have to look at the path that oxygen takes in the body.

00:07:48: That means we have inhalation first.

00:07:50: So our respiratory muscles play a role.

00:07:52: How well do they work?

00:07:54: is?

00:07:54: The chest somehow restricted?

00:07:56: Is the diaphragm not working properly?

00:07:58: so it's something just not working smoothly there so that the breathing volume is reduced.

00:08:03: Then in the next step It depends on whether the lungs are diseased in some way.

00:08:07: If they're healthy, there's rarely a limiting factor to be honest.

00:08:10: but if you've smoked for years that can also be a limiting fact.

00:08:15: The lungs is why the VO-II max keeps getting lower.

00:08:19: Then this oxygen has to be transported from the lungs by our blood vessels.

00:08:23: it's extremely important.

00:08:25: we don't have an iron deficiency because in the end the iron content of our blood is very relevant

00:08:33: Because of the hemoglobin?

00:08:34: Exactly,

00:08:35: because of the Hemoglobin.

00:08:36: But then it's also important that these blood vessels actually reach every corner of the body.

00:08:41: so vascularization... That is very relevant which naturally lowers.

00:08:45: if you exercise less and gets better when you exercise more Then logically it is also important for your heart to work well.

00:08:53: If the pumping capacity in a heart is too poor not enough oxygen can reach all the extremities on the body And the VO-II max will get worse.

00:09:02: And in the next step, logically.

00:09:04: The muscles and mitochondrial density primarily of the muscles meaning these slow twitch muscle fibers so that are relevant for endurance training.

00:09:11: they always have most mitochondria and also consume the most oxygen.

00:09:16: with that we can basically calculate what is called oxidative capacity.

00:09:25: So a lot of things play into that.

00:09:27: Exactly, so to put it simply different organs play role the lungs are important The blood vessels are important the heart is important the muscles are important.

00:09:33: It all has to mesh together somehow and on the one hand That has to do with how quickly the VO two max declines but on the other hand it can also create A kind of Create a kind of plateau.

00:09:45: that means?

00:09:47: The maximum you can reach is also limited to some extent by these factors.

00:09:52: If you have some problem with your lungs, blood vessels muscles heart or somewhere in between then You probably can't reach a very high VO two max like other people who don't Have any problems in all these areas.

00:10:05: That's why you shouldn't despair.

00:10:07: if you Exercise is super lot.

00:10:10: Maybe you have a VO to max of sixty five seventy and just can't get past that.

00:10:14: And your best buddy has seventy-five but does the exact same training?

00:10:18: In The end that might be a bit frustrating But there are just a few things you can't influence.

00:10:26: You can train all of that, you can train your lungs... ...you can train our heart to train muscles and also trained blood vessels in the sense of improving vascularization.

00:10:34: but you should keep it in mind.

00:10:36: That's very relevant!

00:10:37: Basically higher the VO-II max the better.

00:10:40: There is no such thing as too high.

00:10:43: Exactly

00:10:44: Now we said you could measure VO-I max with a spurologometry.

00:10:49: thats classic.

00:10:51: That's also the test that provides the best value.

00:10:53: You sit on a bike, stand on a treadmill wear a mask The intensity is increased in stages and at some point you reach the maximum Intensity!

00:11:03: That's when you can measure the oxygen uptake because you're wearing a mask.

00:11:08: And that's how you can calculate this VO-II max.

00:11:11: We always just say a number but in the end it also has a unit.

00:11:15: It's actually milliliters per minute per kilogram of body weight

00:11:19: Dependent on body weight exactly.

00:11:20: So that plays a big role too.

00:11:25: And these standards, because we said oh... We'd like to have sixty.

00:11:29: That's much more realistic for us than if you're already sixty and trying to reach sixty Because VO-II max is age dependent.

00:11:36: I already said everything inevitably gets worse over time.

00:11:40: We can't escape that right now.

00:11:42: But you can slow it down as much as possible Now.

00:11:47: That's the gold standard.

00:11:48: It's always important to prepare, you have to warm up first so you don't get injured and second So you can perform at your best.

00:11:57: Otherwise it just doesn't work.

00:11:59: otherwise You might get a fifty even though?

00:12:17: Exactly.

00:12:18: So like you say, it is the gold standard but also very prone to error if you don't do right and that's why I think everyone necessarily has to try out how does this work?

00:12:29: And understand what a VO-II max actually means for yourself or your own performance.

00:12:35: so... It can be exciting!

00:12:36: But of course there are always things where you first have to go with someone who has a machine lying around but not even that expensive anymore.

00:12:46: Yeah, it probably costs somewhere in the range of I think three hundred euros.

00:12:49: That could be actually didn't look at up

00:12:52: plus.

00:12:52: you also have to see.

00:12:53: You don't just get this classic spyware agometry under stress but usually Also an ECG?

00:12:57: You get added value beyond Just The VO two max.

00:13:00: you Don't just do It for that But

00:13:02: exactly

00:13:02: Actually the classic test is For people who Have heart problems and you Look At what level Of exertion the Heart Problems occur.

00:13:08: Exactly!

00:13:09: There are also other options that Are a bit easier To Do although They also have their pitfalls Their weaknesses And that includes the well-known Cooper test.

00:13:17: I've run it many, many times in my life even back in school.

00:13:22: Uh i was in a sports high school and The cooper test was a regular thing several times a year Because that's how they tested performance.

00:13:32: That's the classic twelve minute run Yeah, and based on how much distance you cover for us Back then for example in those twelve minutes You had to manage thirty one hundred meters for an excellent back then, and the increments were like with three thousand twenty nine hundred twenty eight hundred twenty seven hundred.

00:13:52: And there's also a table to convert this running performance into a VO two max value.

00:13:59: but as I said it also has its weaknesses.

00:14:02: yeah exactly definitely has.

00:14:03: its weakness is um... It all depends on how much pain you can take right?

00:14:09: But in any case, I think a super...I think it is that for women.

00:14:13: It sometimes overestimates the value of bit or underestimates one-of-the two and have to look at up again.

00:14:19: In any case with women its less accurate than from men but still works pretty well.

00:14:23: The thing about suffering also true for Spiro

00:14:27: That's not true.

00:14:28: So anything involves something like this if you can suffer very well Have high pain tolerance You can artificially increase your VO too much just through

00:14:38: Exactly.

00:14:40: And the third option is the classic wearables that we all wear, there's Woop, Aura, The Apple Watch, Garmin, Sunto Polar just to name them all.

00:14:48: they all have a VO-II max estimation it must be said because they also only calculate it

00:14:54: exactly.

00:14:54: They all have some proprietary algorithm That somehow calculates It.

00:14:57: of course nobody can really look inside.

00:15:00: In the end those things are still relatively accurate.

00:15:02: if you exercise regularly with the watch or device Of course, if you don't provide any cardio data at all other than walking around a bit then the value probably won't be particularly accurate.

00:15:15: That should probably be said.

00:15:16: but they get it done pretty well and that's definitely enough for a trend.

00:15:22: And that's what do want in the end?

00:15:23: You wanna track a trend you want to get better or worse.

00:15:25: For that It simply enough.

00:15:27: um...for that..it simply works.

00:15:29: Well Enough

00:15:30: Exactly.

00:15:31: And yeah, like you said the most important thing is that you still do.

00:15:35: Like I think the standard is five kilometer runs.

00:15:38: Garmin basically suggests to get an initial value to estimate this VO-II max and also relatively accurate.

00:15:46: so there are no completely implausible gross deviations with these wearables as long as actually have movement data not just everyday movements but really athletic movements.

00:15:58: otherwise estimates very inaccurate.

00:16:01: But yeah, as I said there are also new ways to measure VO two max and that is the classic This venturi check.

00:16:11: We've both already.

00:16:12: have you done it yourself exactly?

00:16:13: Yeah i've done It too.

00:16:14: You've done it too.

00:16:15: its a small Seismograph so really an earthquake sensor That you stick on your chest you lie down So you don't have to exert yourself.

00:16:24: thats The big difference.

00:16:25: you just live flat for Two three minutes First lie still for five minutes, then the sensor goes on.

00:16:33: Then the measurement takes place over one to two minutes and then you get a VO too max value And that's done simply through The vibration of the chest.

00:16:42: what I'm just wondering is if in the end it's not quite i mean Sure, the heart's pumping capacity is relevant?

00:16:52: That's actually what it measures right.

00:16:54: But how can you track like the muscles with that?

00:17:00: Can't imagine.

00:17:01: they say it's extremely accurate, but I don't get how.

00:17:04: that's totally unclear to me.

00:17:05: But maybe that's the algorithm behind it which is just doing some extra work.

00:17:08: Um i find That very interesting, but It definitely worked well.

00:17:11: you have To be honest about that You know.

00:17:13: yeah

00:17:13: obviously?

00:17:13: I mean it worked perfectly for Me and I think lutz who we did with back then said They Have an accuracy of over ninety five percent compared to Spyro or geometry Which Is The actual gold standard.

00:17:24: so that's all pretty legit.

00:17:27: you could Say Yeah, you'd have to look closer at what goes into the algorithm.

00:17:33: You do have to enter certain data beforehand like your weight and height.

00:17:36: We can't

00:17:37: do it without that

00:17:38: Exactly.

00:17:38: And then in the end you get the VO two max?

00:17:41: And yeah That actually fit perfectly.

00:17:44: But it's exciting because It's something where you don't have to exert yourself.

00:17:50: It really works at rest

00:17:51: exactly.

00:17:52: You just have to buy this device.

00:17:53: I think it's relatively expensive.

00:17:55: and then you pay Like ten bucks per measurement or something?

00:17:58: I think that's not really for the everyday Joe sitting at home who wants to measure their VO two max every now and then it costs a few thousand euros.

00:18:04: And exactly, and then I think each measurement is somewhere around ten to fifteen euros.

00:18:09: Exactly

00:18:09: That's more for therapists.

00:18:11: Exactly For therapists, sports medicine specialists...I think its'a cool thing.

00:18:15: i think almost nobody has yet.

00:18:16: It also very niche product probably only relevant if you're bit more into topic but it so exciting that exists.

00:18:25: Now let's look at these measurements, which fits in quite well.

00:18:30: And we both looked up a bit what standard or normal values are and What Are Some Nuggets?

00:18:37: Like Which People Have An Extremely High VO-II Max.

00:18:39: and At The End You Prepared Something Else.

00:18:42: I Definitely Put some Wild Some Wild Values In Here.

00:18:45: So It'S Definitely the Case That At Our Age We're Like Mid to Late Twenties.

00:18:49: The Average VO-I max Is Between Forty Three and Forty Eight.

00:18:55: So in this table we have here, it's always a bit different depending on where you look.

00:19:00: I'm actually more in the average upper-average range which isn't really that pleasing when you think about it.

00:19:08: If anyone just wants to see a table like that Just search online for VO two max table and ideally add female or male Depending on what you are Because they are obviously super different.

00:19:17: And for women our age For example It would be thirty six to forty.

00:19:20: so significantly lower.

00:19:22: Why?

00:19:23: Mainly because women simply have a significantly lower body fat, Significantly higher body fat and because it's a mucka per kilogram of body weight.

00:19:32: And men have significantly more muscle mass per kilogram Of bodyweight.

00:19:37: Yeah logically It's just lower.

00:19:38: for woman

00:19:39: yeah exactly.

00:19:41: and the reason is simply that Muscle consumes oxygen and fat Is ultimately just stored energy.

00:19:48: fat doesn't consume oxygen but muscle does.

00:19:50: And because men simply have a higher muscle percentage or generally more muscle as a rule, they simply have A HIGHER CAPACITY.

00:19:59: That's the case with average values but it becomes even MORE striking WITH PEEK

00:20:15: VALUES.

00:20:20: excellent range.

00:20:21: to look at that.

00:20:23: To illustrate this a bit, we also wrote down a few things like everyday things you do if You jog at eight kilometers per hour?

00:20:31: You need a VO two max of at least twenty five.

00:20:34: actually not That high right but well jogging in eight kilometers for hours Also some people can walk that fast so it's not incredibly fast.

00:20:42: Carrying a grocery bag Like home from edeka requires Atleast nineteen and thats already heavy.

00:20:47: Probably depends on how big the grocery bag is, but basically interesting.

00:20:51: Exactly

00:20:51: a giant IKEA bag probably not so much anymore right?

00:20:57: Just getting dressed in the morning requires a VO two max of eight.

00:21:00: well that's very low-very low Right.

00:21:02: But of course it's also something you don't need much for theoretically, right.

00:21:07: So I find that kind of cool.

00:21:08: to illustrate It okay...so You can actually measure everything and VO Two Max And then see Okay i Need this Much Capacity To Do That.

00:21:17: And conversely, you realize okay below carrying that grocery bag it really gets to where you can't do much anymore because carrying a grocery bag is Really no big deal right?

00:21:27: That's why they say below eighteen.

00:21:29: You're actually below the threshold Where you can still manage daily life on your own.

00:21:34: Then you can even carry something yourself any more or you can walk normal distances and so on and So forth.

00:21:40: you really can't manage daily Life On Your Own Anymore.

00:21:42: you probably Can't Even Get A pot out of The cupboard.

00:21:45: And just as a guideline below eighteen, we never want to end up there because if we end up then life is obviously not as worth living.

00:21:55: As you'd like it be?

00:21:56: Because You Just Can't Do Most Things Anymore.

00:22:00: And Then If You Look Further Up There Are These Peak Values and that I found That Extremely Impressive!

00:22:08: The Highest Value Ever Measured In A Woman was Joan Benoit.

00:22:15: She's US Athlete.

00:22:16: Yeah, exactly.

00:22:18: And then if you look further up there are these peak values and that I found that extremely impressive because the highest value ever measured in a woman- That was Joan Benoit...I hope i pronounced it correctly she's an US athlete.

00:22:32: That is why Joan had a value of just over seventy eight!

00:22:36: That means this high value has been measured by women.

00:22:39: for men its ninety seven.

00:22:45: Someone who is probably much better known, is Björn Daley.

00:22:47: He's one of the most successful cross country as I also coincided with here and he apparently had nine.

00:22:52: each man there you can watch out in your dance.

00:22:54: six explorers are going to.

00:22:55: that was Also The highest value ever measured.

00:22:57: a quick early.

00:22:57: apparently There's also an Norwegian athlete Who has values of one hundred two or one hundred three?

00:23:02: But i think those were never officially measured.

00:23:03: so the highest officially measured With a seventy eight for Joe Benoit on the ninety seven for Oscar Svensson Or ninety-six For Bjørn Daly.

00:23:09: And That So Impressive Such High Values.

00:23:11: Okay

00:23:12: Yeah, that obviously Extremely wild, but of course you also have to wonder what kind of substances might've played a role there just To push their own body to the next level right?

00:23:20: I mean Epo was almost certainly used even if not right before competitions But of course they pulled out all the stops.

00:23:26: I'm pretty sure that

00:23:27: Of course The presumption of innocence always applies, but it's always A question.

00:23:32: in competitive sports.

00:23:33: those are obviously incredibly high values.

00:23:35: Yeah.

00:23:35: And then when you get there i think most people do It is an unofficial thing Right!

00:23:39: You don't close to the competition hard training, want to lift yourself to the next level.

00:23:45: And then of course you let it taper off before the competition so that your values are back to normal.

00:23:50: for

00:23:50: comparison Bundesliga players they have a VO two max in the range of about sixty five to seventy

00:23:55: K.

00:23:56: So That's not.

00:23:57: I mean You wouldn't say oh wow?

00:23:59: That's impressive.

00:23:59: I think you can easily achieve that as an amateur athlete with a good training plan With good conditions and your heart lungs muscles and blood vessels.

00:24:07: But exactly.

00:24:08: but soccer is obviously not a pure endurance sport either.

00:24:10: so that makes sense.

00:24:12: have to optimize this one metric, but you also need physical effort and so on agility.

00:24:18: Uh that all has to speed.

00:24:20: uh You also need a bit more body mass for that.

00:24:22: That means the vo two max can't even get that high Which is also perfectly fine right?

00:24:27: It's also mainly due To the-to The speed actually because All the good uh Vo Two Max.

00:24:33: So all the athletes who are very Very Good in VO two max Are cyclists Cross country skiers triathletes.

00:24:39: Oh Right yeah

00:24:40: A classic endurance thing exactly.

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00:25:11: And then you brought something from the animal kingdom for comparison.

00:25:16: Exactly, pretty cool.

00:25:17: actually I mean sled dogs.

00:25:18: You know them.

00:25:18: they're obviously powerhouses to two hundred and forty So a completely different level than in humans.

00:25:26: An antelopes three hundred so that's insane.

00:25:30: Three

00:25:30: times as high as we are in daily.

00:25:32: Yeah

00:25:32: yeah i mean sure but of course completely different conditions Completely different body structure um...you can't really compare it But still super interesting

00:25:42: Exactly, so much for the rough classification.

00:25:45: just to know where you stand.

00:25:47: Like I said it makes sense to look at a table and see what your currently standing and maybe set personal goal keeping in mind that VO two max naturally decreases by something in range of ten percent or fifteen percent if you don't move all per decade every ten years.

00:26:07: Well, not move at all but just don't do any sports.

00:26:09: Exactly no sport.

00:26:10: so really just sitting and having a normal let's say work day without integrating Sports into your routine then it goes up to about fifteen percent every ten years that you lose in VO two max.

00:26:23: if You think about it If you don't have a high starting value Starting somewhere around forty in That range or forty five And Then It Goes Down Fifteen Percent Every Ten Years

00:26:33: Around Forty You Really Start To Notice It.

00:26:35: Then you really notice exactly

00:26:36: and then you can imagine that independence in old age won't be so easy anymore.

00:26:41: or just fitness.

00:26:41: In Old Age, You're just at an age of like sixty seventy years simply not capable of performing any more.

00:26:47: but you Can do something about.

00:26:49: That's the beauty Of it.

00:26:50: And that was to come back To It The exciting thing with Peter Atea.

00:26:53: He said hey set a target value for one hundred Calculate Back what?

00:26:59: That could be VO two max, but it could also be the bench press and so on.

00:27:03: And so forth.

00:27:04: what you have to have today So that you can still manage that at one hundred with The decline.

00:27:10: But then again You have to see.

00:27:12: if you do sports now Then the decline is not fifteen percent

00:27:17: Exactly It's much lower.

00:27:18: On average they say its about six percent.

00:27:21: I mean you Still find triathletes in their eighties who Have a vo-two max of forty or fifty?

00:27:29: And who can still perform really well?

00:27:31: Of course the decline is just much lower.

00:27:34: But the decline unfortunately happens.

00:27:36: We don't have a solution for that yet and probably needs a lot more longevity Intervention.

00:27:42: You can't completely stop the decline.

00:27:43: Yeah, it definitely happens but slowing it down is absolutely worth It.

00:27:47: set a goal for what you might want to have right now.

00:27:51: Get an overview.

00:27:52: The value is too important To just ignore because there are so many studies on it.

00:27:58: A higher VO to max obviously means a higher life expectancy, but it's also one of the most important longevity markers.

00:28:06: Yeah It's actually more telling for your life expectancy than diabetes or smoking.

00:28:10: So low VO two max is worse for you then diabetes are smoking for your live expectancy because Anyone can imagine if you're suddenly like sixty or seventy and can't do everyday things anymore.

00:28:23: That's more limiting that If You burden Your body with Smoking or with diabetes, which is partly treatable.

00:28:30: And then basically you really fall apart and your musculoskeletal system

00:28:36: falls apart... It's a perpetual motion machine right?

00:28:39: If don't move anymore You have no stimulus for muscles For heart, bones.

00:28:45: Everything simply gets worse.

00:28:46: That why the higher The better?

00:28:49: So

00:28:56: in the end, it just lowers the risks on every level.

00:29:00: But that probably also has to do with the fact a higher VO-II max is naturally associated with healthier lifestyle.

00:29:06: so whether this happens directly through the VO-I max or you

00:29:15: can't even filter all these confounders.

00:29:20: but we know its good for everything and bad And we basically never have that in medicine.

00:29:25: No,

00:29:25: yeah exactly.

00:29:26: We rarely have that.

00:29:27: I brought a few study results with me That i found quite exciting.

00:29:31: Every increase in vo two max by three Three point five units Reduces the risk of coronary artery disease.

00:29:40: so Basically The clogging of the vessels and around the heart By fifteen percent?

00:29:46: That means the higher the better.

00:29:48: Um, and all cause mortality by thirteen percent.

00:29:51: So every time you increase your VO to max by three-and-a-half units You lower your mortality by thirty percent.

00:29:57: Incredible actually super simple

00:29:59: a lot.

00:30:01: Actually it's so simple right?

00:30:03: Then It's also extremely relevant for cognitive performance.

00:30:06: So higher VO two max is associated with better cognitive performance A lower risk of dementia And very strongly so.

00:30:13: um.

00:30:17: low cardiorespiratory fitness and therefore also a low VO to max is very, very good predictor of high blood pressure meaning low or non-existent.

00:30:27: High Blood Pressure And that's actually significantly stronger than diabetes in smoking.

00:30:31: this study was from the Cleveland Clinic.

00:30:32: twenty eighteen.

00:30:33: That's Also what we kind of alluded To at The beginning.

00:30:36: it's A Stronger Predictor Of Your Life Expectancy Than Smoking Or Diabetes?

00:30:39: And

00:30:45: the more you pay into it today, The better things will run in.

00:31:02: In

00:31:16: principle though you can say okay more cardio usually means a better view to max right so you could also just start by doing some cardio will probably improve your view to Max over time.

00:31:25: But if you want to specifically optimize via two Macs than the fastest and most efficient way is HIT training, there are different forms that have been tested in studies.

00:31:33: one is the fifteen by fifteen that mean you sprint for fifteen seconds then run easy for fifteen second sprint again.

00:31:40: do that forty seven times.

00:31:43: Yeah, exactly.

00:31:44: I actually marked that because i didn't quite understand why you're supposed to do that forty seven times.

00:31:47: That's just how it was in the study In The End right and um You can probably Do It Less Often?

00:31:51: It Still Has An Impact.

00:31:52: That'S Just How It Was Handled In This Study In This Group That Did HIT.

00:31:56: Um Generally You Have To Be Honest All These HIT Studies Are Super Unstandardized And Therefore You Have Very Little...It'S super Hard To Say Okay Which HIT Training Is The Most Efficient?

00:32:06: Because Because yeah..it all Went A Bit Chaotically Unfortunately.

00:32:09: Just

00:32:09: a Quick Linguistic Detail.

00:32:10: Though There's HIT training and H I dash it training.

00:32:13: So with a double eye, And we're talking about h i dash IT training here meaning high intensity interval training is specifically about these intervals where you have this recovery phases built in

00:32:22: briefly easy than harder again and briefly easy again.

00:32:25: what does hard or sprinting mean?

00:32:29: That means ninety to ninety five percent of your heart rate.

00:32:33: and how do you calculate that?

00:32:35: You calculate your maximum heart rate by subtracting your age from two hundred twenty and then ninety to nine fifty-five percent.

00:32:40: That means you're really stepping on the gas.

00:32:42: So it's really intense, fifteen seconds but in my view doable.

00:32:46: Forty-seven times of course seems a bit wild to me.

00:32:50: and easy training or easy running is then seventy percent of the heart rate.

00:32:54: that's just about where you reach the anaerobic threshold.

00:32:57: And You do that three times a week now?

00:32:59: Then have very rapid increase in VO two max over four weeks.

00:33:04: Yeah To be fair It must said if your relatively at beginning So if you're just starting out and haven't done much sport before, then.

00:33:12: You won't even manage to get into this seventy percent zone in these fifteen seconds.

00:33:16: it's impossible because your-because you so close to a limit

00:33:19: Yeah!

00:33:20: Your gasping for air the whole time?

00:33:21: You don't recover anymore.

00:33:22: That is why It doesn't make sense To start with a fifteen by fifteen split training like that Because As I said, that makes sense when you have a certain training base because otherwise you have to extend the recovery time somehow.

00:33:34: That doesn't work because... Because you need this recovery time for this...

00:33:38: I also found that a bit unrealistic because who does something like that?

00:33:41: I mean, fifteen-fifteen-fifty and that's extremely stressful and also extremely difficult to control right.

00:33:45: so uh i found what was used in other studies The four by Four which is also called the Norwegian way So to speak they call it the nor Norwegian splits more appealing.

00:33:56: It's actually super similar there.

00:33:58: So you also have a four minute sprint, but a four-minute sprint is really a long time right?

00:34:02: And they're at eighty five to ninety percent so A bit less intense than with this fifteen second split.

00:34:07: and then You do three minutes easy Also at roughly seven Norwegian

00:34:10: splits More appealing.

00:34:12: it's actually Super similar There.

00:34:13: so you also Have a four Minute Sprint But the Four Minutes Sprint Is Really a Long Time Right!

00:34:17: And They are At Eighty Five To Ninety Percent So A Bit Less Intense Than With This Fifteen Second Split.

00:34:22: Then You Do Three Minutes Easy Also at roughly seventy percent.

00:34:25: I also find that difficult again for a recreational athlete or amateur athlete right to even maintain this, this eighty five to ninety percent.

00:34:32: Even if you look at your watch then it's super hard To say oh now i'm too fast.

00:34:35: Now i have to slow down Again.

00:34:36: That is not so easy either.

00:34:37: For four

00:34:38: minutes.

00:34:38: So probably when You start It's best Not do something like running But You just get on A bike And can track it all better On the screen in The meantime Absolutely.

00:34:45: Then Of course you Can control it much more Easily by adjusting The watts or the resistance, perhaps also pedaling speed.

00:34:52: I think bike is much more suitable for most people to really implement that.

00:34:56: but yeah That worked very well.

00:34:58: You should do it three times a week if you want have the most impact And those are fastest hacks To increase your VO-TUMAX.

00:35:05: The problem though If only doing so Then won't get past threshold Because we need certain prerequisites.

00:35:10: We remember the VO-tumax doesn't just depend on how much HIT training But depends of factors in body In terms organs.

00:35:19: For that, you also simply have to be taught to use two aging tools.

00:35:24: Toss it get the body classic cardio again at which also takes a bit longer, which improves vascularization and so on And That's actually zone too.

00:35:31: training is also very relevant But that's actually more relevant for long-term maintenance and then also for the next level So to speak if you just want to increase your VO to max super fast and now say okay I'm already in pretty good shape anyway.

00:35:41: I Just wanna add five sessions Now or maybe even ten and in the fastest time possible.

00:35:45: Then just go full throttle with HIIT training.

00:35:48: The keyword is in good shape because if you have a VO two max of thirty five, then it's.

00:35:54: Absolutely not smart to start with Norwegian splits because your body isn't used to the strain at all.

00:35:58: If you haven't done any sport at all before than exactly well Not only that At least You probably don't know how to warm up.

00:36:05: Well How To Get Into Your Optimal Window?

00:36:07: Either That Means You Have Few Comparative Values.

00:36:09: The Risk Of Injury Is Higher Because With A Semi-Maximal Sprint You Can Also Quickly Have A Muscle Fiber Tear Or Two.

00:36:16: That'S Why Joints.

00:36:18: If you're not used to that, then just start with zone two work on a bit of basic endurance and then sprinkle in the HII training.

00:36:26: The IT training?

00:36:28: I think that's a pretty good option.

00:36:30: but if your already going running regularly anyway plans there is actually little against starting right away this HIII training or these Norwegian splits which i think it done much more frequently.

00:36:42: .I only ever hear about Norwegian splits at this fifteen by fifteen

00:36:45: And this fifteen-by-fifteen isn't really realistic for most people either Or it's just no fun, right?

00:36:49: It's terrible.

00:36:50: I mean... ...I can't quite understand how they came up with this split but it was done in a very good study and HIT had really crazy impact on people.

00:37:01: so that is pretty exciting

00:37:03: And also makes sense to come from Norway because we learned earlier Björn Daly-Oskar Svensson-Ninety-Seven that one Norwegian triathlete who supposedly has one hundred two or one hundred three That they perfected there.

00:37:18: It's the same size as Austria, but

00:37:21: in terms

00:37:21: of population.

00:37:22: No no not in terms area exactly.

00:37:24: Norway is obviously much larger But yeah that's definitely a training quick hack.

00:37:29: Theoretically these Norwegian spits or this fifteen by fifteen.

00:37:34: If you haven't done much sport up to now You start with zone two training very classically In the range of sixty to seventy percent Of your maximum heart rate.

00:37:41: That means it actually A pace where You can still talk whether you're on a bike or running.

00:37:48: and then the thing is basically done.

00:38:11: And you can also do HIIT training in just ten minutes, so at the end of day that will have an impact... That was just in studies with The Craziest Impact!

00:38:21: You'll see it too.

00:38:25: Apart from training everything else has to fit too.

00:38:30: Genetics is a topic but roughly in range where we always say only twenty percent.

00:38:36: genetics relatively similar with VO-II max, and then the factors iron you already mentioned.

00:38:45: You need to be sufficiently supplied with iron—you need enough B-II.

00:38:49: also folic acid is needed because that's important for the formation of blood cells.

00:38:53: so actually a very classic derivation.

00:38:56: we need more red blood cells We need enough hemoglobin So that we can even transport enough oxygen And the mitochondria must have course function well... ...and the more mitochondria you have The better your VO-I will be.

00:39:08: Body composition, that's a topic where women simply have a disadvantage because they just genetically have more body fat less muscle.

00:39:17: In general though the less fat you have The more you have of this fat-free muscle mass.

00:39:22: So fat free mass meaning muscle mass and the better the VO two max is.

00:39:26: so overweight people also Have a much worse VO to max than lean People.

00:39:31: it's just I mean It's very very logical in its derivation exactly Because then others just more muscle.

00:39:38: And the most important thing which is always, always important when we talk about training is sleep and recovery.

00:39:46: you should get enough sleep even sleep more.

00:39:48: When do these very intense sessions?

00:39:51: If You have a bad recovery score in The morning or A low HRV Which We also did an episode on.

00:39:59: then please just don't Do high intensity interval Training.

00:40:02: Exactly, definitely.

00:40:03: And I mean you also have to think for someone who might already be doing strength training relatively often and then wants to bring in these HIIT workouts than maybe skip a strength-training day... ...and do HIIT instead of not on top it just because it may only take fifteen minutes Because you'll quickly end up over training.

00:40:21: simple as that.

00:40:22: No professional athlete does high intensity training every day.

00:40:25: most the time.

00:40:26: they actually use zone two training And do very low threshold training just so they stay fit.

00:40:32: So, maintain their capacity and then there are a few days where They really go all out because otherwise the risk of injury is too high.

00:40:40: That's actually how everyone should handle it.

00:40:42: You shouldn't think I'm suddenly king now Can blast through every day.

00:40:48: Do three HIIT workouts on top.

00:40:50: Yeah i think especially once you've done this HIIT Training twenty minutes can be incredibly exhausting.

00:40:57: Yeah, that's intense.

00:40:57: Just the or even just those twenty eight minutes of those Norwegian splits.

00:41:01: That and I mean you are done at the end of that.

00:41:04: if you did it right If you really pushed yourself to the limit in that eighty five to ninety percent range.

00:41:11: It's time for a break

00:41:14: What we maybe haven't made so clear yet?

00:41:16: I'd like to talk about it very briefly.

00:41:17: We did mention zone two training and said how long you should do it but we didn't explain exactly How To Do It for those who might not know it so well.

00:41:25: I know, It's been all over the place now and lots of influencers have talked about it but maybe one or two people still haven't heard of it?

00:41:31: Maybe we should discuss that briefly.

00:41:32: So zone Two is by definition always below the anaerobic threshold.

00:41:37: That means as long as were using a lot of oxygen And fat burning are in-fat burning Um...that means For most people its at about sixty to seventy percent Of their maximum heart rate.

00:41:48: You can calculate that again.

00:41:50: Two hundred twenty minus age Roughly right.

00:41:52: so for us roughly one hundred ninety a bit more.

00:41:56: And what you can say is the simpler explanation.

00:42:01: four it's just to speed where you can still talk relatively well.

00:42:04: while doing that, you can theoretically run next someone else or ride a bike next to someone else and you could still talk normally but your still in a range of effort right and moving.

00:42:15: you know its just barely.

00:42:17: you can stop talking.

00:42:18: then comes the next threshold were you cant talk anymore have to breathe out significantly more CO-II because you're getting into the anaerobic threshold and that's exactly where zone two ends.

00:42:27: Exactly, everyone should do classic base endurance training.

00:42:32: we should too Max.

00:42:34: yeah We should

00:42:35: definitely integrate it in our routine.

00:42:37: maybe once Zone Two Training a week And then I'm

00:42:40: already doing twice now Norwegian

00:42:41: splits will Do that together on the track?

00:42:44: That would be good.

00:42:44: A Good thing.

00:42:46: there are also some other smaller.

00:42:49: I'll call them VO to max hacks in quotes because it's not just about saying you're doing HIT training now, Because the principle of HIT Training is that You have these heart rate spikes.

00:43:01: So you have to manage once or better several times a day To set micro-training stimuli where The heart rate goes up Once and even if That's running quickly Up the stairs Anyone can do that.

00:43:13: Most people can easily Do that in their daily lives unless your office is on the ground floor.

00:43:17: Your apartment is on The ground floor and you really never have to use stairs, but even then You can Sprint for twenty thirty meters real quick.

00:43:25: It's just about getting the heart rate up?

00:43:27: You still have To get your steps In For the day.

00:43:31: But micro micro training stimuli they also Have a an impact That shouldn't be underestimated.

00:43:39: They won't make your VO two max jump from fifty to sixty.

00:43:43: But it's a general principle to expand cardio training, and get these small training stimuli.

00:44:13: blood count since mostly, actually it's just about ferritin and transferrin saturation.

00:44:17: Those are really the only important values you should look at.

00:44:21: everything else isn't as relevant.

00:44:23: that's important if you eat a vegan diet.

00:44:25: That's important If You're A Woman very classic And whenever you feel like your training a lot but not getting better then It Just Makes Sense to Look At Your Iron Status.

00:44:37: But Definitely Don't Just Supplement Iron On A Wim.

00:44:40: Always Do It Only after measuring first because

00:44:43: exactly that can make sense for athletes.

00:44:46: Yeah, so basically iron supplementation Can makes sense but only if it stays roughly within limits Because too much iron is simply toxic for the body ruins The liver ruins a lot of other things to.

00:44:57: That's why never.

00:44:58: It's not something you should just take without thinking

00:45:02: Exactly and always measure copper two a copper deficiency can cause an iron Deficiency or make an iron deficiency phenotypic.

00:45:13: Don't overdo it with zinc.

00:45:14: Exactly, we also have to see about that.

00:45:16: but as I said so if you have a copper deficiency It can be an iron deficiency shows up in the blood count But its not real iron deficiency and You should always keep that in mind A bit.

00:45:25: You measure ceruloplasma And then everything is covered.

00:45:29: That's the copper transporter.

00:45:32: Otherwise Anything that improves oxygen efficiency In some way

00:45:39: Very good

00:45:40: is also good for VO two max or training in general.

00:45:43: What is there?

00:45:44: In terms of, let's say supplements or nutrition hacks

00:45:50: exactly.

00:45:51: so maybe with these supplements and nutrition hacks it's not something that increases vo to Max on its own.

00:45:56: That doesn't really work right?

00:45:57: That's extremely difficult but in combination with cardio training It can of course improve your view to Max.

00:46:03: And we're talking about things like beta alanine, which is basically a lactate buffer.

00:46:07: That means the muscles simply last longer.

00:46:11: when The mussels are heavily used A lot of lactate is released Which subsequently kind of intoxicates the muscles.

00:46:16: let's say and if you take more beta alanin then the muscle Simply lasts longer buffering this lactate.

00:46:22: Then there's stuff like citrulline malate Basically just an nitric oxide donor.

00:46:29: Nitric oxide the substance of all things, what does it do?

00:46:35: It basically dilates the blood vessels and thereby significantly improves blood flow or its significantly improved blood flow.

00:46:43: And very interesting not only citrally malate can help super well because it delivers a lot of nitric oxide but also beetroot juice.

00:46:52: we thought that was pretty cool.

00:46:54: That apparently works very well too.

00:46:55: exactly spinach is.

00:46:58: Spinach also contains betaine.

00:47:00: Betaine is generally important for the muscles themselves, Also in interaction with creatine.

00:47:06: It doesn't necessarily make the VO-II max better either just like other things don't But it improves muscle growth.

00:47:14: More muscle means more fat free mass, more mitochondria, more ability to take in oxygen To actually burn oxygen.

00:47:22: That means it will also be indirectly good for athletic performance and thus, also four VO two max.

00:47:28: And in the last episode about my routine I also said that i like to take create not creatine but carnos scene?

00:47:36: And that makes sense too.

00:47:37: carnos seen is In The End just For Athletic Performance and Thus Also Four VO Two Max.

00:47:44: And that makes sense too, carnosine is in the end just deep peptide made of beta alanine which we already mentioned and histidine.

00:47:58: That has basically the exact same effect.

00:48:00: it's a lactate buffer.

00:48:01: It absorbs these acidic muscle products a bit better like a sponge.

00:48:03: you don't have to take it continuously either.

00:48:05: it Has a depot affect?

00:48:11: the most important little hacks you can implement in daily life.

00:48:22: Setting these micro-training stimuli, watching your diet a bit to make sure you supply nitrogen let's say could be beetroot or spinach.

00:48:29: You also cover that quite well with supplements and otherwise definitely do zone two training.

00:48:33: Get your iron status checked if vegan If female And if you feel like you're not really making progress in training.

00:48:39: Yes!

00:48:40: Norwegian splits Nobody likes it but...

00:48:42: That is where they go.

00:48:43: But generally any kind of interval training at end just push hard brief pause Push Hard again Doesn't have to be four minutes.

00:48:50: It can be just one minute, it could be just thirty seconds in the end.

00:48:52: that's probably not even that relevant.

00:48:54: The main thing is you do like once or twice a week and show your body That should spike its heart rate every now-and then.

00:49:01: And I think what rarely happens when doing regular strength training Maybe some relaxed jogging You never get into those zones and thats ultimately What u should take away.

00:49:09: i think that you just do some interval training Every Now & Then and basically takes no time at all.

00:49:14: Thats the way to go.

00:49:17: And the most important takeaway message from today's episode is actually that VO two maxes super important for longevity, for health.

00:49:25: For all sorts of things for cardiovascular Health or cognitive performance dementia and so on and so forth.

00:49:31: It's not just a gimmick.

00:49:33: That's on your watch or in the smartphone app But it's really really important health indicator that also has a real impact.

00:49:41: There's no such thing as too high.

00:49:43: The higher the better.

00:49:44: So train train train and also align your life a bit to increase your VO two max as much as possible.

00:49:50: And then you actually have a very good setup for the future.

00:49:55: Yeah, so real longevity biomarker So-to speak.

00:49:58: yeah if not the bio marker par excellence?

00:50:01: Yeah totally

00:50:03: Wonderful do you ever?

00:50:03: nice closing word?

00:50:06: well I think i think four guys like us.

00:50:09: in The end it's just that cardio isn't Just something You should Do To lose weight Quite The opposite.

00:50:14: It's Not Even necessarily The best Thing For Weight Loss but Its Actually Just Something.

00:50:17: uh, you should do for your health and for your fitness.

00:50:21: And so that you really feel good in everyday life can do everything You want to do an every day live?

00:50:26: And especially still doing it in thirty years.

00:50:28: and um That's how I should think about It and that's How you should approach it and then you're very well positioned To lead a long and Very very fulfilling Life.

00:50:37: i have nothing to add to that very beautifully said.

00:50:39: So, if there are any questions on your end then feel free to write as always to podcast at beyondlifespan.de or comment on Apple Podcasts and Spotify on YouTube.

00:50:50: We read through everything.

00:50:51: we usually answer the comments directly now anyway.

00:50:54: otherwise get a review on all kinds of platforms or just feedback what you like, don't like so much.

00:51:10: Or what topics might want to hear about?

00:51:12: Just let us know!

00:51:13: Otherwise Max it was pleasure.

00:51:15: thanks for listening and have good time.

00:51:18: see next time

00:51:19: bye.